Debian looked very good for me when I discovered it,but now after 2 months since kde 3.4 launch Debian STILL uses kde 3.3 and the old X server. Instead Ubuntu provides the >>latest<< KDE,Xorg and >>drivers<< .

just instaled ubuntu....
-kde 3.4 looks good and is faster that the older KDE(maybe xorg has something to do with this)(if ubuntu has .debs for kde why debian has not !? see the previous post)
-had little problems with network config
-noticed the reduced download speed from ubuntu site
-the same mp3 problem like Redhat(these patents are killing me )
-the locked state of the superuser(root)"In Ubuntu, the traditional UNIX 'root' account is disabled"
-the kernel is not displaying so much text (I had quiet in debian)
-some packages are newer on debian ftp(valknut(dcgui-qt))
-comes with drivers(for ati nvidia matrox;not open source because of the companies) this is a big + for Ubuntu

Maybe i will get back to debian. for a few days I will test Ubuntu....

You can get X.org and KDE 3.4 with little trouble if you look harder Some sympathy for the release work done for Sarge is better for your karma.

Well enjoy it then......I'm missing your point here I guess. All the things you mention WILL be in Debian but only when it's finished. Somethings take time.......

You'll be back once all theose apt-get dist-upgrade's start borking your system...lol

Don't forget that Ubuntu is made from Debian Sid, so most packages on Ubuntu will always be behind Debian...

However, Ubuntu is a fine distro and I'm sure you'll have lots of fun playing with it.

hey, good luck, since ubuntu is for human beings. i guess your not an alien like the rest of us!

This is not entirely accurate. Ubuntu uses a lot of Sid packages, but they are highly customised and it also builds its own. This is the source of conflict with some people in the Debian community at the moment because they say Ubuntu could be bad for sarge, since its work cannot be easily passed back to the development of sarge.

Yes, there is a good article on Distrowatch weekly in which Ian Murdoch expresses his opinion, which

is not exactly favourable for Ubuntu and others (it's the "Ian" in the name Deb Ian, yes..)

Have fun until x.org starts crashing on you. When it's released with Debian you can be sure it'll be stable then. BTW, you can use both with Debian now if you're inclined to do a bit of research and that setup is likely to be more stable than Ubuntu is now (yes I'm bitter that my 2day old Ubuntu borked itself.. Debian never did that to me, not even while using the unstable repositories). Don't get me wrong, I love the idea of Ubuntu, and the way it's set up.. not to mention the absolutely *KILLER* users guide that is posted (Major kudos to whoever wrote that.. it's extremely impressive), but it just does not have a solid, grounded feel that Debian does.

I think if someone wants the latest packages then Ubuntu and other Debian derivatives could be the right choice for them. If they want stability, then Debian is the way to go. The problem with Debian is that the release cycle is so slow. Its ok if you are running a server because you are guaranteed to recieve stable packages and security updates with Debian stable, but for a desktop user, most packages would be outdated. By the time sarge is released, the packages included will be outdated as well. This is why there is big defection from Debian itself to distros such as Ubuntu.

I think the debian maintainers delay the launch of KDE 3.4 because sid should then use kde 3.3 so until the release we must stay with kde 3.3 which is not a good thing for the desktop users(who want the latest ,eye candy apps )

I dont want to "look harder" i want to find kde 3.4 and xorg on ftp.debian.org .

I agree with the first statement. The rest is hogwash.

Debian release cycle is slow? Compared to Fedora, yes, but compared to Windows XP ... Debian only releases when it is ready, period. Why sacrifice quality and stability for peer pressure? If you are too impatient, then there is a world of distributions for every need. Just stop criticizing.

For the desktop there is testing, unstable and experimental trees to pick from. And if you have the CLI 'nads, you can always compile what you need. Your statement of outdated packages is simply false. I'll admit there is extra work involved setting things up and you may in instances trade stability for bleeding-edge but this is the same with every distro.

If you find Sarge dated, track Etch, which will be the next testing. It's what I plan to do.

Big defection from Debian? I'm sorry but where is it you are getting your facts, and are there even any statistics tracking Debian usage. Did you not read recently that the city of Munich has just adopted Debian for servers and desktops? This is real evidence, not speculation. New distros will come and go, that's a given, but I can assure you as a devout Debian user, I will not defect on a whim for yet another pretty face.

I mean you no offense, but please stick to the facts.

I thought KDE 3.4 that only adds some basic things to KDE 3.3 like Accessibility and I forget the two other things that are different depended upon what kernel and X-Window System server you were running.

I'm not upgrading to 3.4 because I don't need those three new things or was it two?!