Installing linux should not be this hard

OralDeckard · 07-02-2007, 06:25 PM

Yes, sdavis78, it will work on other versions of Linux. I used to use SuSE. I was using 10.1 when Novell sold out to Microsoft and I had to go somewhere else. I settled on Fedora as the least inferior distro. I had a hard time adjusting, bemoaning the lack of YaST, and went through some real grief at work because I converted both the server and the backup server to Fedora while thinking I was making an inferior product get the job done. But to my surprise Red had is nobodies inferior. I wouldn't go back now even if Novel did the right thing. Fedora is a long way form perfect, but everything is. It is a testbed for Red Hat Enterprise Linux, so it will never be as bug free and stable, but I get the new toys two years before the Fortune 500 guys waiting for it be be wrapped up in the next release of RHEL.

I had a hard time mounting network shares, until I found out that I had to create a folder in the place I wanted to mount the share, and give it the share's name. I didn't have to do that with SuSE. But then I found out SuSE was doing that for me behind the scenes. That left me too ignorant to do it myself.

I build, install, configure and maintain about 15 Windows Workstations and two Linux for my engineering company. I have been maintaing Windows since it came out. And at this point I have to say, we will soon be running Fedora as the main OS on all of them, and Windows 2000 virtual machines where Windows is necessary. Who needs Vista when you have Fedora 7 ? All it lacks is the hype.

armyNinja · 07-02-2007, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OralDeckard

PS. Are you really an army ninja ?
(spoken in the same tone as my daughter when she was 5, upon meeting a National Guardsman just before Christmas; "Are you a aoaf" ?

I am an Active Duty Ninja. I am actually headed to Iraq in a couple weeks. I am a captain in the Army, and my 8 year old calls me "THE captain of the Army," which I think is pretty cool.

armyNinja · 07-02-2007, 10:15 PM

Here is my new problem... I cannot get display larger than 640x480 even though i have larger display resolution listed in the xorg.conf file. I can at least now see the gnome windows in 640x480 but when attempting to change resolution using the GUI, there are no other resolution options. When I use command line xrandr, there are no other options either. My video card in xorg.conf is now set to "vesa"
Not sure what the next step is???

OralDeckard · 07-02-2007, 11:04 PM

Well Captain, we're going to have to get the right so that your daughter can get some use out of it while your over there. I have a nephew over there.

Now that you have a graphical interface, its time to fire up yumex.
If you have done a minimal install just to get to this point like I suggested you may not have yumex yet. Open up a terminal window and su to root, then type "yum install yumex"

That's the Yum Extender. It give Yum a graphical interface, so you can see what you have installed, what is available, and what needs updated. The packages are grouped by catagory, so you can browse through packages that are just for Gnome, or Just for KDE, or just for any of whatever.

I had the 600x480 problem too, and fixed it by going to the KDE section and downloading the rest of what I needed. I'm sorry, I did't install much from Gnome, only what came by default, and got back to KDE as quickly as I could.

Unless you are really stuck on Gnome you might consider taking KDE for a spin.
Or, it might be that Gnome is all you have right now because that is what the default is, and you have to install KDE to get it. If so you will want to install Switchdesk. You can do that with "yum install switchdesk" or select it with yumex.

You might want to set your daughter up with her own profile. When you get back she will be the Linux expert

Or mayby your are installing this on a laptop that is going with you.

I'll check here tomorrow to see how your yumex went. When you get in it will show you a lot of packages in read, insisting that they need to be updated. Just be aware that once it starts it will go on for hours, so you don't want to start an update thinking you will do that for 10 minutes and then do what you went in there for. You can go to Gnome or KDE or both and select the packages you want, THEN allow it to update all those files along with the ones you have selected while to you go bed.

chrism01 · 07-03-2007, 01:46 AM

BTW guys, to preserve formatting in posts, use the [ code ] [ / code ] tags (only without the spaces)

The result looks like this

Code:

some
    indented_code
here

enjoy

Nearly forgot. If you've got a GUI working, here is an excellent Linux guide: http://rute.2038bug.com/index.html.gz

OralDeckard · 07-03-2007, 05:35 AM

Thanks Chrism01! That will help a lot.

So Captain, would yo care to post your xorg.conf file, using the code tags. I have been trying to remember exactly what it was I did to fix my resolution problem. Last night I thought it was something in KDE, but about 0300 I remembered that for me it was 600x800, and was fixed in Gnome at the same time which wouldn't happen from a KDE fix.

No, my resolution problem occured with an installation of F7 in a VMware virtual machine, and was fixed by daring to replace the vmware monitor with the actual, physical monitor.

Graphically in Gnome, go to System, Administration, Display. There you can select the hardware tab and use the dropdowns to select your video driver card and your physical monitor.

I shouldn't have suggested KDE. KDE may be fine, but there is no point in complicating things by trying to solve new problems before the present, more serious one is solved. And I really thing that telling Fedora what your display hardware is will solve your resolution problem.

And of course one final thought: As nice as Vesa is right now, it is not ideal. For instance, if you have an nVidia card, you would be better off with an 'nv" there. When you tell it what your video hardware is, it will adjust your xorg.conf file, and if what it puts in is wrong, it will go through a few inconvenient screens and end up re-loading your preveious version. Every time you modify a text file, Linux renames the original to have a ~ on the end, so it can fall back if the new version goes sproing.

armyNinja · 07-03-2007, 07:19 PM

All,

my xorg.conf file has the following applicable items

Code:

 
# XFree86 4 configuration created by pyxf86config

Section "ServerLayout"
        Identifier     "Default Layout"
        Screen      0  "Screen0" 0 0
        InputDevice    "Mouse0" "CorePointer"
        InputDevice    "Keyboard0" "CoreKeyboard"
EndSection

Section "Files"

# RgbPath is the location of the RGB database.  Note,
this is the name of the
# file minus the extension (like ".txt" or ".db"). 
There is normally
# no need to change the default.
# Multiple FontPath entries are allowed (they are
concatenated together)
# By default, Red Hat 6.0 and later now use a font
server independent of
# the X server to render fonts.
        RgbPath      "/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/rgb"
        FontPath     "unix/:7100"
EndSection

Section "Module"
        Load  "dbe"
        Load  "extmod"
        Load  "fbdevhw"
        Load  "glx"
        Load  "record"
        Load  "freetype"
        Load  "type1"
        Load  "dri"
EndSection

Section "InputDevice"

# Specify which keyboard LEDs can be user-controlled
(eg, with xset(1))
#       Option  "Xleds"         "1 2 3"
# To disable the XKEYBOARD extension, uncomment
XkbDisable.
#       Option  "XkbDisable"
# To customise the XKB settings to suit your keyboard,
modify the
# lines below (which are the defaults).  For example,
for a non-U.S.
# keyboard, you will probably want to use:
#       Option  "XkbModel"      "pc102"
# If you have a US Microsoft Natural keyboard, you can
use:
#       Option  "XkbModel"      "microsoft"
#
# Then to change the language, change the Layout
setting.
# For example, a german layout can be obtained with:
#       Option  "XkbLayout"     "de"
# or:
#       Option  "XkbLayout"     "de"
#       Option  "XkbVariant"    "nodeadkeys"
#
# If you'd like to switch the positions of your
capslock and
# control keys, use:
#       Option  "XkbOptions"    "ctrl:swapcaps"
# Or if you just want both to be control, use:
#       Option  "XkbOptions"    "ctrl:nocaps"
#
        Identifier  "Keyboard0"
        Driver      "kbd"
        Option      "XkbModel" "pc105"
        Option      "XkbLayout" "us"
EndSection

Section "InputDevice"
        Identifier  "Mouse0"
        Driver      "mouse"
        Option      "Protocol" "IMPS/2"
        Option      "Device" "/dev/input/mice"
        Option      "ZAxisMapping" "4 5"
        Option      "Emulate3Buttons" "yes"
EndSection

Section "Monitor"
        Identifier   "Monitor0"
        VendorName   "Monitor Vendor"
        ModelName    "Unknown monitor"
        HorizSync    31.5 - 37.9
        VertRefresh  50.0 - 70.0
        Option      "dpms"
EndSection

Section "Device"
        Identifier  "Videocard0"
#       Driver      "s3"
#       VendorName  "Videocard vendor"
#       BoardName   "S3 Trio64 (generic)"
        Driver      "vesa"

EndSection

Section "Screen"
        Identifier "Screen0"
        Device     "Videocard0"
        Monitor    "Monitor0"
        DefaultDepth     24
        SubSection "Display"
                Viewport   0 0
                Depth     16
                Modes    "800x600"  "1280x1024"
"1024x768"
        EndSubSection
        SubSection "Display"
                Viewport   0 0
                Depth     24
                Modes    "640x480"
        EndSubSection
EndSection

Section "DRI"
        Group        0
        Mode         0666
EndSection

I recently added the comment marks next to the wrong video card driver listed (I have an ATI 1800XL all in wonder). I also deleted the 640x480 resolution line hoping to force it to 800x600

Thanks

OralDeckard · 07-03-2007, 08:31 PM

Well Captain, your problem may be obvious.

Near the bottom you have not one, but two sections specifying resolution. The one having three options is for 16 bit color (depth=16). The one for 24 bit color has only one option listed, 640x480.

Try adding a few resolutions to that and see what happens

And if that fails, try system, administration, display and checking/changing the monitor. If this s a VM it will be a vmware monitor. Usually that does not need to be changed, but on mine I was stuck with 600x800 until I did.

Peter_APIIT · 07-04-2007, 03:14 AM

You can try Mandriva 2007 free version because its got a good hardware support. Install Linux isn't as difficult as you think.

I hope this help.s

sdavis78 · 07-04-2007, 06:14 AM

Can't access and change the xorg.conf file. I haven't tried it in fedora yet, but in suse the /x11 folder must be hidden I guess. I can get to the /etc folder, but rhats as far as I can get. I am logged in as root user. I have found some programs that run in windows to let me see and even copy the file so I can edit it in windows, but I can't copy it back to linux. So much for that idea.

chrism01 · 07-04-2007, 07:25 AM

Just FYI, in Fedora, the directory is /etc/X11 ... note the UPPERCASE X. All *nix OSes are case-sensitive(!)

sdavis78 · 07-04-2007, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrism01

Just FYI, in Fedora, the directory is /etc/X11 ... note the UPPERCASE X. All *nix OSes are case-sensitive(!)

I did the caps for x11. Still could not see the folder. But this was with suse 10.2. I guess I'll try Fedora in the text mode like the other guy suggested, then try to get the graphic interface going that way. But I was trying to avoid this, because I will have no clue what I'm doing in text mode.

OralDeckard · 07-04-2007, 12:54 PM

Oh, it will give you clues. Its not like you have to enter complex command line stuff with accurate syntax or anything. It will prompt you for a few things, and you can make a few selections, and you're in.

The easy way to do it is to put off detailed package selections until you have it up in graphical form. Just do a minimal install, then after you reboot and log on as root, open a text editor like VIM and adjust your /etc/X11/xorg.conf file, then save and reboot again. This time you should be able to log on, then startx.

sdavis78 · 07-05-2007, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OralDeckard

Oh, it will give you clues. Its not like you have to enter complex command line stuff with accurate syntax or anything. It will prompt you for a few things, and you can make a few selections, and you're in.

The easy way to do it is to put off detailed package selections until you have it up in graphical form. Just do a minimal install, then after you reboot and log on as root, open a text editor like VIM and adjust your /etc/X11/xorg.conf file, then save and reboot again. This time you should be able to log on, then startx.

Ok, but I did mess around with VIM on another distro, and I don't get it. How do you open a file and tell it where the file is? There is no menu or help. Is there another text editor I can run that is installed. Or is there a Doc or manual somewhere that will explain how to use it?

(EDIT) Nevermind I did a search on line and found some documentation on VIM. Its interesting though because a picture of it show a menu. Hmm, why didn't I see a menu?

OralDeckard · 07-05-2007, 12:22 PM

That's why I hate it, and wish it wasn't the only game in town. But maybe its not.

Yesterday I experimented with several editors, and settled on Joe as an improvement. But Joe will not be installed with the minimal install. Maybe you can yum install joe. If so,
open the file by joe /etc/X11/xorg.conf, then once you are in, [ctrl]KH for help and look in the upper right.