Raphaël Hertzog's "Debian Rolling" proposal

jens · 04-29-2011, 08:59 AM

http://raphaelhertzog.com/2011/04/27...cut-manifesto/

http://raphaelhertzog.com/2011/04/28...oes-it-entail/

http://raphaelhertzog.com/2011/04/29...ebian-rolling/

From the dev list:
http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel...ads.html#00602

Very early draft:

Quote:

Title: Debian endorses usage of testing by end-users, and renames it to rolling

The Debian project recognizes that the Debian testing distribution—initially created to make it easier to prepare and test the next stable release—has become a useful product of its own. It satisfies the needs of users who are looking for the latest stable versions of software and who can cope (or even appreciate) a system that’s constantly evolving.

The Debian project decides to endorse this usage and will strive to provide a good experience to users of “testing”. To better communicate this policy change to our users, “testing” will be renamed “rolling”.

While we believe that this is a good move, we would like to remind our users that Debian is a volunteer project and that our resources are not infinite. Package maintainers are contributing to Debian on a best-effort basis. This means that they might not be able to properly support their package(s) in all distributions. In that case, the project recommends that maintainers apply the following priorities:

1. Support in stable (security updates, release critical bugs)
2. Preparation of the next stable release
3. Support in rolling

j1alu · 04-29-2011, 11:30 AM

He proposes a lot.

jens · 04-29-2011, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by j1alu

He proposes a lot.

Please read the comments in that last (debian-devel) link.
He's really not alone on this.

I assume you don't like this? Why?
Sure, many folks will disagree on this (whatever this may be) as it obviously will have some downsides as well.

At least he's one of those few among us who still have the guts to do something (instead of the usual endless flaming on mail lists).

EDIT: Would you rather see that Ubuntu-like Debian-CUT project?
As for your "He proposes a lot" claim, could show some examples (Raphael being wrong)?

I like people who actually do things.

craigevil · 04-29-2011, 03:37 PM

Not a new idea:
Debian CUT - http://cut.debian.net/

Constantly Usable Testing - http://kitenet.net/~joey/code/debian/cut/
Note the date: Last edited late Wednesday evening, December 24th, 2008

widget · 04-29-2011, 04:56 PM

I have nothing a against proposing this at all. I do not, however, see any real benefit from having it implemented.

I just do not see that there is any gain to be had for testing users. The freezes are very short and they all happen toward the end of the cycle. Kind of a nice break from update/upgrading for very little spurts.

If they change it fine. If they don't, who is really going to care?

j1alu · 04-29-2011, 05:00 PM

Quote:

As for your "He proposes a lot" claim, could show some examples?

http://raphaelhertzog.com/products/debian-cd-dvd/
http://raphaelhertzog.com/2010/12/20...erve-its-name/
For more just follow http://planet.debian.org for a while.
I did not say he is wrong. I said he proposes a lot. Often things which are good for headlines, for a short and excited discussion.

I like people who actually do things ...-after having thought about it,and long.
Simply doing "something", just to _do_ something, is nonsense. For me.

I don't see the point in CUT, but that was not why i posted.

the trooper · 04-30-2011, 04:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by widget

I have nothing a against proposing this at all. I do not, however, see any real benefit from having it implemented.

I just do not see that there is any gain to be had for testing users. The freezes are very short and they all happen toward the end of the cycle. Kind of a nice break from update/upgrading for very little spurts.

If they change it fine. If they don't, who is really going to care?

You have pretty much summed it up for me here.
Can't say I see a huge benefit,and if this is the way of the future then I'll probably say fsck it and just use Unstable full-time.

k3lt01 · 04-30-2011, 04:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the trooper

You have pretty much summed it up for me here.
Can't say I see a huge benefit,and if this is the way of the future then I'll probably say fsck it and just use Unstable full-time.

To me unstable would be the better option for a Rolling release. Doing it that way would still allow the devs to continue working as they do now and continue Debians legendary stability. Making Testing the Rolling release can't work effectively considering they have a 6 month freeze and alot of things can be upgraded in 6 months. LMDE claims to be a rolling release yet not alot happens when testing is in the freeze cycle, well it didn't when I was using it.